|  |  | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 13:02 | |
| | Hello
What type of COM/NAV radios and instruments do you prefer for Morava ? I don't want to put Bendix/King insruments into it, but there isn't too much option from the eastern block.
What is your idea? |
| |
|
 |  | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 13:17 | |
| | | |
|
| | | | Instruments for Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 13:50 | |
| | Překlad dotazu:
Ahoj
Jakému typu COM/NAV ráda byste dali přednost v Moravě? Nechce se mi tam dávat Bendix/King přístroje, ale pro východní blok není mnoho možností.
Jaké máte nápady? |
| |
|
| | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 14:46 | |
| | Hi Gaspen,
Look there: http://bit.ly/1s4Gwpj
As you can see many Moravas using Garmin GNS 430. From my point of view it is ideal choice.
I am using payware addon SIMFLYER - "SERIES X" GNS-SX in some aircrafts. So if you "prepare a place" for this avionics in your model, I appreciate it very much.  |
| |
|
| | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 15:00 | |
| | | |
|
|  | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 15:14 | |
| | That depends. You could either make a historically correct L200 with "classic" radios and no GPS. Or you could make a modernised one - an aircraft who could with no problem fly in today's complicated airspace.
My heart would go with the historic one. However, when the plane will be ready, it will probably be often used for online flying with RNAV points and all that s**t.
Therefore I vote for two panel variants. One classic and one modern. |
| |
|
 |  | | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 15:44 | |
| | I also prefer a historic IFR version, with 1x NAV/ILS and 1X ADF setup, but it depends on what can I find. I like better dials, instead of digital displays For example I think there wasn't LUN NAV radios / instruments manufactured (?)
In the case of the COM radio, it's quite easy because I put and duplicate the LUN from the Z-142. In the real Morava there is two switch on the overhead panel ti turn on the radios. But in FS when I switch on COM1 (in fact transmit on COM1), COM2 will switch off and vice versa. I think it's an acceptable "bug" |
| |
|
| | | | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 17:19 | |
| | I think L-200 is so historic type, that there was no "historic version" with ILS. As to my knowledge, the maximum (standard) equipment was COM (ev. 2xCOM) and ADF (ev. 2x ADF). The navigation filosophy in heavy weather was the same, as during the WWII. Instead of ILS (that was not available at those days) only the PAR (precision approach radars) were used (at some airfields).  |
| |
|
| | | | | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 19:41 | |
| | This is very correct! To be historically accurate nothing more than ADF should be present. In the "aerotaxi" times, brave men criss-crossed the whole Czechoslovakia in heavy weather relying only on on needle on the ADF, while the directors of the state-owned companies comfortably slept on the ingenious back couch of the L-200
Therefore no ILS, no NAV on the historic panel! But for the practicality of using the model, "modern" panel should be used as well, for those who wanna fly the modern procedures. And with "modern", I have on my mind everything starting with VOR |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | Morava 2. 11. 2014 / 21:11 | |
| | It was my mistake to to take this question here 
Just kidding, we'll see what can we do |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | Morava 3. 11. 2014 / 09:54 | |
| | Yup, you gotta take in account that there are a lot of us old plane lovers here
Do not try us with Bendix-King or GPS. |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | Morava 3. 11. 2014 / 10:04 | |
| | But there are lot of Moravas with the Bendix-King equipment, which seems to be ancient enough for pilots, who wants to fly IFR - e.g. - see polish SP-NXA, I think that this is the "classic example" of a "westernized morava": http://www.airliners.net/photo/0581751/
To SONP:
the magic of the english grammar is, that your post has two meanings:
1) you are the lover of the old planes
2) I am the old lover of the airplanes
Both are true!
|
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | Morava 3. 11. 2014 / 10:28 | |
| | and I am the old lovers of the old planes
|
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | Morava 3. 11. 2014 / 10:54 | |
| | | |
|
| | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 10:55 | |
| | I thing the main problem is, that now you can hardly find the two Moravas, that have the identical avionic equipment, either the original, or the refurbished one.
So my proposal is to choose one or two particular Moravas as the template for the panels.
Her are some typical layouts:
A. Simple traditional - OK-PHG (1xCOMM)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/FTO-Petr-Navratil/Let-L-200A-Morava/0979215/
B. Doubled traditional - OM-FOE (2x COMM, 2x ADF)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Let-L-200A-Morava/1546789
C. Sophisticated classics - OK-PLJ:
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1089881/l200d-ok-plj-aircraft-industries-kunovice-uhe-lkku/
D. Westernized - OK-KML (2xCOMM, 1xILS, 1x ADF, 1x VOR/DME - easy to build in FS)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Let-L-200D-Morava/1320030
E. Polish Western - SP-AKS, SP-KMI, SP-NXA (2xCOMM, 2xILS - also easy)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Let-L-200-Morava/0581751
F. Glass - OK-OLT
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1170597/l200a-ok-olt-private-jicin-lkjc/
G. Absolute glass - OK-WHN
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1131746/l200d-ok-whn-bemoair-bmi-brno-brq-lktb/
My vote:
1.- D - OK-KML
2.- B - OM-FOE
----------------------------------------------
Myslím, že problém je v tom, že teď už lze stěží najít dvě Moravy se stejnou avionikou ať původní nebo po rekonstrukci.
Proto navrhuju vybrat jednu nebo dvě konkrétní Moravy a jejich panely použít jako vzor. Tady je několik typických uspořádání:
A. Jednoduché tradiční - OK-PHG (1xCOMM)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/FTO-Petr-Navratil/Let-L-200A-Morava/0979215/
B. Zdvojené tzradiční - OM-FOE (2x COMM, 2x ADF)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Let-L-200A-Morava/1546789
C. Propracovaná klasika - OK-PLJ:
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1089881/l200d-ok-plj-aircraft-industries-kunovice-uhe-lkku/
D. Západní - OK-KML (2xCOMM, 1xILS, 1x ADF, 1x VOR/DME - dnadná do FS)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Let-L-200D-Morava/1320030
E. Polská západní - SP-AKS, SP-KMI, SP-NXA (2xCOMM, 2xILS - taky snadná)
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Let-L-200-Morava/0581751
F. Skleněná- OK-OLT
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1170597/l200a-ok-olt-private-jicin-lkjc/
G. Absolutní sklo - OK-WHN
http://www.planes.cz/cs/photo/1131746/l200d-ok-whn-bemoair-bmi-brno-brq-lktb/
Tady je můj hlas
1.- D - OK-KML
a
2.- B - OM-FOE
Jaký typ panelu byste preferovali vy?
|
| |
|
| | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 11:00 | |
| | | Ja sa prihováram za OM-UHC |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 12:37 | |
| | To je sice hezký, ale bylo by dobré sem dát i odkaz nebo obrázek, aby i ostatní věděli, které uspořádání preferuješ.
Já nevybíral 5 Morav, co se mi líbí, ale 5 nejtypičtějších uspořádání (vybavení avionikou). Ty Moravy tady jsou jen jako typickém příklady. Jestli to má mít nějakou hlasovací váhu, tak jen pokud se na nějakém shodnem, ne pokud bude mít každý svůj... |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 12:56 | |
| | Vaše želanie je mi rozkazom, pane. . Okrem toho všetky materiály (už aj pred dvomi rokmi) a informácie potrebné Bencemu som zháňal od pilotov tejto Moravy ktorá je v leteckej akadémii v Žiline.
Preto preferujem túto... |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 13:02 | |
| | OK, dík.
Tohle uspořádání jsem nevybral, protože je to dle mého soudu tak trochu ani ryba ani rak, sice americká avionika (2xCOMM, ILS, VOR/DME, ADF), ale prapodivné uspořádání na palubce, dva různé horizonty, z nichž ten hlavní, pokud vím, zatím nikde vymodelován není.
Pokud by se někomu tato varianta líbila - a chtěl by jí dát hlay, OK - nazvěme ji třeba :
varianta G - OK-UHC.
Má zatím jeden hlas - od Joža.
|
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 13:11 | |
| | | To je OM-UHC... nie OK-UHC A z maďarských sa mne osobne páči táto. Ovšem či sa bude páčiť aj Becemu a Tibimu, neviem... |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 13:42 | |
| | | No jo, ale jak vypada uvnitr? Vnejsek uz si kazdej namaluje jak chce. (Ja osobne repainty vubec nepouzivam je mi celkem jedno jak letadlo vyada zvenku.) |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 13:45 | |
| | | maďarskí priatelia to vedia... |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 15:26 | |
| | Promiň Jožo, ale o tom se tu fakt diskuse nevede.
Pokud dobře chápu gaspenovy poznámky, tak se jedná o uspořádání panelu - obecné, univerzální, ne že každá morava bude mít jiný panel, jako to kdysi do FS9 udělal Instruktor v megahangáru - tam to ještě díky 2D panelům šlo, ale do 3D VC to je nad lidské síly.
Gaspen navíc uvažuje, že by stejně udělal dvě verze - jednu jednodušší, s tradičními, originálními budíky z let padesátých a východního sektoru (se kterou samozřejmě nepůjde létat IFR tak, jak jsme dnes zvyklí) - a druhou, vybavenou avionikou Bendix-King v nějaké univerzální konfiguraci, aby se s tím dalo i dnes moderně létat po světě.
No a máme vzácnou příležitost se shodnout, jak by asi ten který panel měl vypadat - jak ten tradiční (historický) a jak ten moderní. POkud tu 10 lidí řekne, že chce každý něco jiného, kdoví jak to dopadne. A na tom, zda má morava zvenčí červené nebo bílé proužky - tedy teď zrovna fakt nezáleží.  |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 17:34 | |
| | | To mi je jasné, to som len tak na okraj. Stejne si myslím, že si Gaspen urobí podľa seba. |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 23:06 | |
| | | Kumo mě by se líbila ta druhá od konce |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 4. 11. 2014 / 08:38 | |
| | | Ta úplně vpředu je taky parádní |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 4. 11. 2014 / 09:45 | |
| | | Čéče, já myslel že se Ti líbí Mařenka Dvořákovic, ta s těma velkýma oné... |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 4. 11. 2014 / 12:04 | |
| | Však ta sedí v tej morávce, ne?
On vidí za roh - i na panel i na tu Máňu tam (s těma přednostma)! |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 5. 11. 2014 / 15:34 | |
| | Najprv zhotovíme fotografiu z reálneho lietadla a potom osadíme z databázy prístroje, spínače, ovládače a avioniku. Výsledkom je 2D-panel. Potom zostáva iba doladiť letové vlastnosti ...
|
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 19:49 | |
| | | Hehe...this paint scheme in this photo was designed by me for the original HA-LDC. Attached you'll see my master-file for preview to the owners. |
| |
|
| | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 11:11 | |
| | | Yes, I found out this solution also yesterday : choose two real plane for the basics of the FSX panel. So I gave this task for Tibi |
| |
|
| | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 17:53 | |
| | | |
|
| | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 18:06 | |
| | | Aby som sa teda nevystrkoval z radu, volím tiež B+C |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 19:23 | |
| | | |
|
| | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 20:50 | |
| | | |
|
| | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 20:58 | |
| | | Negative. OK-PLO has no ADF, OM-FOE has two. |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 3. 11. 2014 / 21:24 | |
| | | So, statistically, they are both the same and they both have one ADF |
| |
|
| | | | | | | | | Morava - volba panelu 4. 11. 2014 / 07:20 | |
| | | Sorrry, you did not caught the sense - the main panel is nor emphasized, the concern is about the radios - and, unfortunately, OK-PLO is (on this picture) rčefurbished, allready, it has western avionics. OM-FOE has "LUN" radios - and that is the point. |
| |
|
| | | | Morava 3. 11. 2014 / 22:54 | |
| | So, finally I offer two versions :
#1 : simple VFR with 1xCOM and 1XADF, both from Zlin, because they are ready
#2 : full VFR based on Bendix avionics : COM and NAV with standby frequency, ILS, dual ADF, XPDR and maybe a GPS.
But don't ask me about the release date |
| |
|
| | | | | Morava 3. 11. 2014 / 23:45 | |
| | | Oh ! And what about the autopilot? You'll need it on the around-the-globe journey... |
| |
|
| | | | | | Morava 5. 11. 2014 / 13:37 | |
| | Ahoj Tibi, Gaspen a Jožo!
Momentálne som sa vrátil z chalupy a som na svojom hlavnom počítači. Podarilo sa mi nájsť podkladovú fotografiu lietadla OM-OHJ. Lietadlo malo dve čsl. rádia typu LUN. Pracovali dobre. Malo dve ADF-súpravy a jednu VOR/ILS/DME súpravu. Signál bol vyvedený do "veľkého" HSI a aj do RMI. Práve na tomto lietadle získalo svoju prvú IFR-kvalifikáciu mnoho čsl. pilotov ... Dovolím si poznamenať, že za palubnou doskou bolo veľmi málo miesta a bolo tam hromada káblov, vyvedenie kúrenia a vetrania + mohutné ložiska riadenia, pre "berany". OM-OHJ bolo typu L-200A - s elektricky stavanými vrtuľami.
Jsem schopný a ochotný poskytnúť Vám akúkoľvek informáciu o tomto lietadle.
Navrhujem spracovať dva modely:
L-200A - dvojlistá elektricky stavaná vrtuľa. Cestovná rýchlosť v letových hladinách bola cca 250 km/hod
L-200D - trojlistá, hydraulicky stavaná vrtuľa konštantných otáčok. Cestovná rýchlosť v letových hladinách bola cca 240 km/hod. Výhodu bolo, že vrtule mali lepšiu účinnosť vo fáze štartu, na priblížení účinnejšie brzdili lietadlo a konce listov vrtule boli mierne vyššie od terénu.
----------------
Hi Tibi, Gaspen, Jožo!
I just came back home and I am by my main computer. I found the picture of the plane OM-OHJ. This plane was eqiuiped by two czechoslovak transcievers LUN. They were operating very well. The plane had two sets of ADF and one set of VOR/DME/ILS. The signals led to the "big" HSI and to the RMI, too. Exactly on this particular airplane, most of the czechoslovak pilots got their IFR rating... I dare to say, there was lack of space beyond the main panel, there were piles of wires, air and heating tubes and mighty bearings of yokes. Particularly this plane - OM-OHJ, was the L-200A type, with electrically changed prop pitch.
If needed, I am experienced enough and prepared to give any detailed information about this airplane.
My proposal is to prepare two models of this craft:
L-200A - two bladed electrically operated props. Cruising speed in cruising levels was 250 km/h
L-200D - three bladed hydraulically operated constatnt speed props. Cruising speed in cruising levels was 240 km/h. The advantage was, that these props had a better efficiency during take-off and on final the props produced a higher drag. The prop blade tips had a greater clearence above the surface. |
| |
|
| | | | | | | Morava 5. 11. 2014 / 13:39 | |
| | | To je krásne a vyčerpávajúce, ale mňa si tam nemusel spomínať, ja nie som autor Moravy... |
| |
|
| | | | | Morava 4. 11. 2014 / 07:22 | |
| | I think this is really great offer! Many thanks in advance!
PS: autpilot in the version No. 2 would be fine... |
| |
|
|
